Clint Eastwood Forums

General Information => Clint Eastwood Westerns => Topic started by: Icecoolmister on May 07, 2004, 06:57:44 AM

Title: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Icecoolmister on May 07, 2004, 06:57:44 AM
I watched 'The Outlaw Josey Wales' on TCM television last night , and I just want to say that I enjoyed it immensely. It must rank as one of the best cowboy films ever. I w 8)ill be watching it again in the near future.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: vik on May 07, 2004, 07:08:07 AM
it is the best cowboy ever

mister your cool

but of course you haven't seen the others yet
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: MakeItVin on May 10, 2004, 01:43:33 PM
Yeah, the Outlaw Josie Wales is great.  The scene where they've crossed the river but have the run-in with Ladge & Co. is great.   More superb casting: the close-up shot of his face, the drawl, everything.  

'...real slow, so I can count the haaaaiiirs on that hand....'

'...shut up Ladge...'

And of course: '....she thinks I'm some sort of Cherokee chief....!'  
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Icecoolmister on May 10, 2004, 03:36:18 PM
I particularly liked the quote " Are you going to use those pistols or whistle Dixie?" ???
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: tekker on May 13, 2004, 06:13:32 AM
Yeah Josey Wales is a great western.

I highly recommend the Josey Wales SE DVD.
Apart from the superb transfer and the (quite good) 5.1 audio, it also contains a 35 min all-new documentary.
The documentary is highly informative and includes interviews with all of the cast. Also, Clint talks about how much this film means to him.

I have always felt that this movie is my "gold watch". And by that I mean that I like to keep this DVD away, and when my friends ask if I have a god movie and can pull out Josey Wales and show them a really good film...

Anyone else feel that this is Clint's "forgotten" film?!?
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: dane with no name on May 13, 2004, 06:51:32 AM
Quote
Anyone else feel that this is Clint's "forgotten" film?!?
Forgotten!!!  :o Not at all. That title would go to Hang em high.
Every time i try to convert some of my
non-clint-believing friends to proper clint worship, ;) i show them (ot talk about) OJW, and every time so far they all say something like ; OOOHH, Iīve seen this movie before, itīs so cool. When i mention Hang em high, i usually get blank stares.

 
 
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: tekker on May 14, 2004, 03:30:05 AM
Yeah, that's my experience as well.
Love to impress my friends, who usually watches such films as the Matrix films which, quite frankly, does not impress me at all.  
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Washingtonian on May 14, 2004, 11:43:01 AM
I have my DVD copies of both of those movies. OJW is an excellent movie.

They have something in that territory called a Missouri boat ride. :)
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Eagleye on May 14, 2004, 08:39:07 PM
This is just one of Clint's great western movies! He is a bad man from the bad lands...a farmer minding his own buisness >:(  Josey is a man of heart and the classic icon of the Old West..."I reckon so"! You just don't get any greater classic phrases, facial expressions, or even the way you spit your baccor(tobacco). I love this film along with the many other westerns that Clint made!!!
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: dane with no name on May 16, 2004, 06:26:20 AM
Quote
who usually watches such films as the Matrix films which, quite frankly, does not impress me at all.
heh, josey wales could wipe the floor with neo anytime. ;D

I think that one of the reasons OJW is such a good western, is because we got the usual revenge storyline which later turns into a "help each other" storyline.
Josey have lost his family, and future, and heīll be damned if heīll let that happen to anyone else.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: tekker on May 16, 2004, 09:17:34 AM
Yes, right on!

But don't forget to add flawless direction, superb cinematography, sublime acting and a oscar nominated score.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Opeth on May 18, 2004, 06:12:24 PM
My fav:

"...shouldn't we bury 'em?"

"Buzzards gotta eat, same as worms."
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Walker on May 21, 2004, 11:09:09 AM
We still had Drive-Ins when this movie came out and that was great!  BUT, I still had to see it indoors to get the full effect of this sound track.  At least that was the story I told my girlfriend when we saw it the second time   ;D
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: mgk on May 21, 2004, 11:20:02 AM
Welcome to the Eastwood Web Board, Walker.  :D

When it comes to Eastwood, any and all excuses are acceptable when you're wanting to watch one of his movies. ;)

Hope you enjoy dropping by the board often.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Mr Soul on July 08, 2004, 08:24:38 PM
Yeah, great flick.  One of my favorites.  One of these days I'll have to get around to reading the book.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: angeleyesTHE2nd on July 09, 2004, 11:00:12 PM
i didn't know there is a book to josey wales :o
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: tempest on July 09, 2004, 11:54:43 PM
It's a good book, I read it years ago. It's called The Outlaw Josey Wales a.k.a. Gone To Texas. It's a pretty good read if you can find a copy.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: KC on July 11, 2004, 07:49:54 PM
We discussed the book briefly in a thread last August.

The book is in print and can be ordered from Amazon.com (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/isbn=0826311687/clinteastwood-20/) for $11.48 plus shipping ... and you'll benefit this site, which has an affiliation with Amazon. (I hope I copied that link correctly so the affiliation will work.)

This is a University of New Mexico Press edition from November 1989, and it contains the original novel, which was originally published in 1973 under the title The Rebel Outlaw: Josey Wales, and subsequently under the titles Gone to Texas and The Outlaw Josey Wales, and the 1976 sequel, The Vengeance Trail of Josey Wales. It also has an Afterword by Lawrence Clayton.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Wombat on July 21, 2004, 02:38:21 AM
The Outlaw Josey Wales is, I believe, the strongest film made by Clint.  It not only has a story to tell of one man's struggle against 'being wronged' but it brings into play a number of topics that are now viewed in a politically correct light today.  Josey, in my opinion, is true to himself and true to what is right and what is wrong in the world of his time.  These points are also applicable to this day and age.  I have a copy of this film and I think I may have watched it, over the years,  maybe 100 times (guess).  And every time I watch it I see and feel something different.  Brilliant.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Squinty on July 21, 2004, 08:12:25 PM
I have to admit myself, The movie had an epic quality that seemed to be missing in some of the other Malpaso films. It brought back that Leone feelign we all feel so warm about.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Wombat on July 22, 2004, 05:24:03 AM
One aspect of the acting that Clint has perfected is the facial expressions and mannerisms that convey so much.  For instance if you recall the start of Josey Wales, Clint does not say a word until he buries his Family and the first conversation is with 'Bloody Bill'.  And all he says to Bloody Bill is "I'll be going with ya".  But there is absolutely no doubt in my mind what Josey is feeling and what his immediate intentions are.  This aspect of all Clint's characters, in my opinion, far surpasses any other modern actor - male or female.
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Squinty on July 22, 2004, 09:05:24 PM
I have to agree with you there. Clint always had an intense look about him. And when he'd channel those emmotions, they really guided the viewer. And according to clint, the emptiest barrels are usually the emptiest. So obviously, most of his characters don't have extensive lines. And this was really evident in OJW. He was pretty much on the top of his game (acting wise anyway)
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Josey_Wales30121 on July 27, 2004, 10:17:29 PM
I have watched OJW at least 50 times. Joseys philosophy of life are words to live by.

Dying ain't much of a living.............boy
Title: Re:The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Perry on July 28, 2004, 01:03:39 PM
 ;D Hi Guys

Josey Wales to me is his best western and maybe his best movie. I remember seeing it 4 times when it came out in 1976. I think what I loved about it was the great performance of Chief Dan George. I am not sure If people realize what a great performance he gave and the dignity he showed as a an Native american which up intil that time was rarely if not ever shown, especially the sense of humor he exuded. I think what I remember was reading the Daily News that mrning and seeing the film critic Kathleen Carrols blurb "good Shot Clint"and giving the movie 3 stars. It was probably the firt time i ever saw a positive review for Eastwood ever. Rex Reed and that other imbecile Pauline Kael had always had a field day with Eastwood, though I have to admit I hated 'The Gauntlet " myself.
Josey Wales was a tremendous film and Eastwood's finest directing at that point. I still think its a better movie than Unforgivin. I like Unforgivin, but that movie lags a little in the middle. Two different films, but both greatly directed.

                        Perry
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Christopher on March 19, 2010, 06:06:22 PM
I finished the novel today. Here's from one of our discussion threads from back when we discussed The Outlaw Josey Wales:

Quote
Unbeknownst to Eastwood, and nearly everyone else at the time, Forrest Carter had a secret past. Forrest Carter was born Asa (Ace) Earl Carter--in his past, he had been a professional racist, a segregationist, a founder of a Ku Klux Klan branch, and a speechwriter for George Wallace, in which capacity he had composed the celebrated line, "Segregation now! Segregation tomorrow! Segregation forever!" His claim of being half Indian was either a complete fabrication, or the truth, depending on whom you asked. Shortly after writing The Rebel Outlaw: Josey Wales, Carter published a book that would become a literary phenomenon: The Education of Little Tree: A True Story, a supposedly autobiographical account of Forrest (Little Tree) losing his parents during the Great Depression and growing up with his "Granma" and "Granpa" as he learns about nature and the Cherokee way of living in harmony with the earth. (It has subsequently been reissued as fiction.)

Although many would see only beauty and tolerance in Forrest Carter's writing, Philip Kaufman, who worked on The Outlaw Josey Wales screenplay, and was the original director was not as impressed:


Quote
"'Fascist' is an overworked word," says Kaufman from his California home, "but the first time I looked at that book that's what I thought: 'This was written by a crude fascist.' It was nutty. The man's hatred of government was insane. I felt that that element in the script needed to be severely toned down. But Clint didn't, and it was his movie." Eastwood eventually fired Kaufman and went on to direct himself.

I'm really intrigued with who Forrest Carter really was! I remember the point was made once on this board how a theme of the book is actually that all people can live peacefully together, and I got the same sense from the book. I do get a sense of the "hatred of government" that Kaufman talked about, but that really doesn't bother me.

I like the fact that the movie added to the ending, to make it a more satisfying movie or perhaps to give it a sense of closure. I did like the ending of the novel though. This is one instance where the movie actually darkened up the ending a bit since Wales actually does go off by himself in the end. I also liked the additional information about Ten Bears. He is a very interesting character and much of that was left out of the movie (and probably for good reason--it just may not have fit).

Who else has read the novel? I plan on watching the movie soon--I actually haven't seen it in a long time!
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: KC on March 19, 2010, 07:16:55 PM
Here's a link to the post Christopher is quoting from, where you'll find a link to the source of the Philip Kaufman quote:

http://www.clinteastwood.org/forums/index.php?topic=2985.msg43740#msg43740
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: The Schofield Kid on March 19, 2010, 08:32:25 PM
Thanks Christopher,

I haven't read the book in about 20 years. I just got it down off the shelf after reading your post & I'm going to re read it again once I finish Huck Finn.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Lin Sunderland on March 20, 2010, 04:53:42 AM
This was shown on UK Channel 5 in a series of Eastwood movies and I decided to watch it again.  It isn't one of my favourite movies but I did enjoy seeing it again.   Each time I watch one of Clint's movies I 'see' more into them and they take on a whole new dimension, as this one did.   I would like to see it on the big screen but doubt that will happen so will have to make do with DVD's and TV showings.  :(
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: higashimori on March 20, 2010, 05:22:41 AM
I would like to see it on the big screen but doubt that will happen so will have to make do with DVD's and TV showings.  :(

 Last year, I saw it on the big screen for a first time !  What a great one ! !   I have loved more that before! ( with DVD or TV )
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: PeterD on August 07, 2010, 03:07:55 AM
Just watched Josey Wales. It is a top film, enjoyed it a lot but in no way does it compare with so many of Clint's other movies - The Dirty Harry series, Thunderbolt and Lightfoot, The Gauntlet etc.

Josey is a fine film but doesn''t match a few others of his, in my opinion.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: fisty on September 26, 2010, 10:18:17 PM
One thing above all else in this film, is the fact it shows the truth about how the North killed Confederate troops after they surrendered. And that one thing that is a big black eye from the civil war that will never heal.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: bdc28 on February 01, 2011, 08:26:31 AM
Ahhhh, Josey Wales.

I would say probably one of the best westerns ever made.

This was one of the few movies that actually managed, at least in my humble opinion, to touch on the redemption of the human soul.

Josey Wales lost his family to the war. Clearly he was driven by hate and the desire to annhiliate anything relative to what, he deemed, relative to the death of his family, and therefore himself.

"Buzzards gotta eat, same as worms" was a great illustration of just how dark Josey's soul had become, and how heartless the war had made him. No forgiveness to enemies, not even in their death.

But a path that takes him out of the war, reconnects him to human beings. Even as the ghosts of his past in the war chase him down.

I think this movie truly speaks to a higher character in people...unparalleled movie.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: herofan on March 10, 2011, 06:21:56 PM
It's one of my favorite Eastwood films.  Back in the late 70s and early 80s when movie rentals were yet to come and theatrical movies were shown on tv a lot, OJW was one that seemed to be on "all the time" as the featured evening movie.   OJW, Every Which Way But Loose, The Gauntlet, The Enforcer, and Escape From Alcatraz were on so much that I knew them by heart.  The only other non-Eastwood movie that was on so much was Smokey and the Bandit. 
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Richard Earl on April 03, 2011, 08:58:55 PM
Ahhhh, Josey Wales.

I would say probably one of the best westerns ever made.

This was one of the few movies that actually managed, at least in my humble opinion, to touch on the redemption of the human soul.

Josey Wales lost his family to the war. Clearly he was driven by hate and the desire to annhiliate anything relative to what, he deemed, relative to the death of his family, and therefore himself.

"Buzzards gotta eat, same as worms" was a great illustration of just how dark Josey's soul had become, and how heartless the war had made him. No forgiveness to enemies, not even in their death.

But a path that takes him out of the war, reconnects him to human beings. Even as the ghosts of his past in the war chase him down.

I think this movie truly speaks to a higher character in people...unparalleled movie.


Well put BDC!
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: JackBurns on August 28, 2011, 11:17:00 AM
I finished the novel today. Here's from one of our discussion threads from back when we discussed The Outlaw Josey Wales:
 
I'm really intrigued with who Forrest Carter really was! I remember the point was made once on this board how a theme of the book is actually that all people can live peacefully together, and I got the same sense from the book. I do get a sense of the "hatred of government" that Kaufman talked about, but that really doesn't bother me.

I like the fact that the movie added to the ending, to make it a more satisfying movie or perhaps to give it a sense of closure. I did like the ending of the novel though. This is one instance where the movie actually darkened up the ending a bit since Wales actually does go off by himself in the end. I also liked the additional information about Ten Bears. He is a very interesting character and much of that was left out of the movie (and probably for good reason--it just may not have fit).

Who else has read the novel? I plan on watching the movie soon--I actually haven't seen it in a long time!

I just picked up the Blueray copy and have read the book. As for the film, I think it's one of Clint's finest films, enjoyable in every aspect. So many great, legendary lines. I've probably seen it one hundred times.  The film is true to the book except for two notable exceptions. There's no "Fletcher" in the book and no "Captain Redlegs," which means the scenes involving those two, especially the memorable final scenes where he kills the redleg and talks with Fletcher are not in the book. Neither is the scene where the guerillas are cut down by the Gatling gun.

As for the script writer that called Carter a "fascist," he obviously doesn't understand fascism too well. A fascist would support central government. Carter may have been racist, but he was probably more "anarchistic" in his views on government. Yet, the book is written true to the time in which it was set.  To assume views portrayed in a work of fiction are a reflection of the author's own views is ridiculous. It's fiction.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Christopher on August 29, 2011, 07:26:40 PM
Yeah, I agree that characters aren't necessarily going to reflect the person creating them.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: mystang52 on November 22, 2011, 12:37:16 PM
Am I the only one uncomfortable with the film's ending?  OJW is my second favorite behind The Good..., mainly because I don't think the ending made sense. 
Texas Rangers are taking a statement, with Fletcher, from the town guy (forget his name) that Josey was killed in Mexico. Josey walks in, still bleeding.  The Rangers (and Fletcher) didn't know that a raid just happened at the ranch?  And just like that the Rangers close the case? 
The timeline doesn't seem logical.   I always wrote it off as literary license, but after all these many years every time I watch the movie it bothers me  :(
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: rojblake on January 16, 2012, 04:29:49 PM
The ending is, indeed, murky..but I believe it to be intentionally so. I don't think Josey is dying (unlike another iconic western...Shane where the subject is still debated).
Historically speaking the Rangers fought with the confederacy & were, for a time, disbanded. So either the arc of the story is longer than it seems or Mr. Eastwood took liberties.
However that would mean that the "redlegs" may not have been in touch with the Rangers (believing them to be no better than other rebels).

Even with the death of Terrel Josey is likely to be haunted for years afterward (which was also part of the point made by the story), it seems unlikely that he will "settle down" & take up farming again.

There are those who would disagree & that is part of Mr. Eastwood's genius, he leaves the ending entirely up to the audience.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: KC on January 16, 2012, 04:44:49 PM
Very well put, rojblake!

Fletcher surely knows what happened, but he is Josey's old comrade and elects not to betray him.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Whistledixie on June 25, 2012, 11:01:57 AM
Got to see part of Josey Wales a couple nights ago while visiting a friend with cable -- which sadly I don't, since AMC was running a "Crazy About Clint" marathon and playing a bunch of his flims! Alas...

Also realized I'd misquoted him awhile back when talking about my user name, and that the line isn't "You gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?" but is in fact "Well, you gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?"

Apologies. I'll understand if I'm unforgiven...

Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Lin Sunderland on June 26, 2012, 12:05:11 AM
Got to see part of Josey Wales a couple nights ago while visiting a friend with cable -- which sadly I don't, since AMC was running a "Crazy About Clint" marathon and playing a bunch of his flims! Alas...

Also realized I'd misquoted him awhile back when talking about my user name, and that the line isn't "You gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?" but is in fact "Well, you gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?"

Apologies. I'll understand if I'm unforgiven...



Your forgiven Whistledixie.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: Whistledixie on June 26, 2012, 06:52:26 PM
Thanks Lin!  ;)

Gotta say, it's an even better line with that "Well" at the beginning, since it adds an even more casual and prodding air...  once again, yay Clint! To think I'd been saying it wrong all these years...since back when I first caught it on TV, probably around the time it was first aired, and through repeated viewings...shame on me!  :D TOJW will always hold a honored place in my heart since, although my older brother's viewing habits made Eastwood movies and the like ubiquitous in the living room growing up, it was the first one I watched all on my own from start to finish and is arguably one of the best, and thus became "my" Clint Eastwood movie, and not one handed down from my bro. And the whistle Dixie line was what stuck with me the most. Now correctly so! Yay for me!  ;D
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: TomTurner on May 18, 2018, 06:12:59 PM
Last Christmas day this show was on TV and my brother-in-law and my 2 nephews watched the entire film.  I was pleased to discover he is a fan of the movie.

I have seen this move more times than I can count, and I'm able to quote what I thought was an impressive number of the more memorable lines in the film along with the actors.

However, my brother-in-law, who is a bodybuilder and not well known for his mental facilities, absolutely shocked me by reciting EVERY SINGLE word in the movie!  Even tiny little incidental things like someone saying hello, he nailed, to the word.

It was an impressive display.  I have never seen anything like it.
Title: Re: The Outlaw Josey Wales
Post by: AKA23 on May 19, 2018, 04:37:24 PM
Wow. Good for your brother-in-law. He sounds like a true fan. I can do that with many of the conversations in "In the Line of Fire," which is my favorite Eastwood film, but I can definitely not recite the whole movie from memory. That is truly impressive.