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Author Topic: Pale Rider and High Plains Drifter  (Read 49854 times)
Americanbeauty
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« Reply #40 on: January 08, 2007, 12:21:14 AM »

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« Reply #41 on: January 08, 2007, 03:59:05 AM »

 :-[ Yea
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« Reply #42 on: January 09, 2007, 06:05:28 AM »

re: PR.

Clint's eyes have a strange unearthly look to them, if you look closley.
Contact lenses?
He's "back from the dead". Revenge on Stockburn for killing him.
(nobody could survive 5-6 bullets around the heart.)
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Americanbeauty
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« Reply #43 on: January 31, 2007, 06:24:32 PM »

Clint's eyes have a strange unearthly look to them, if you look closley.
Contact lenses?
Hi, archangel  :)

I totally agree with you. It's an interesting point. His eyes have always intrigued me.

We've discussed this HERE in an earlier thread -feel free to add your comments  O0

Some of us argued that it was probably only because the film is so dark. I honestly don't know. I'm still not convinced by this explanation. I'm sure it's part of the character. Isn't he the Angel of Death?
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« Reply #44 on: September 10, 2007, 10:24:41 PM »

Actually, believe it or not, its pretty clear to me that Clint Eastwood is only dead in High Plains Drifter, not in PALE RIDER. But in each movie you have to pick up the character motives, because they arent the same. The teacher actually inferred some of their own opinion into it.

HIGH PLAINS DRIFTER: Its made pretty clear that the people that killed Marshall Duncan are the least on his mind. His concerns are actually extracting revenge on the people of Lago. For a brother, or a relative, to be able to know that his brother was killed..he would be more concerned about his killers, not the people that caused the demise. You would have to be a citizen of Lago to know that. Most of the movie concentrated on the exacting of revenge on each character. Even in his leaving right as his killers arrived, leaving the townspeople of Lago to know his feeling of helplessness.

There was also his stealth, in killing his killers...he made some very slick and unworldly physical moves, which if you think about it..is impossible. To go from whispering "help me" in an alley to being twenty or thirty feet behind someone...thats impressive.

PALE RIDER: In actuality, the Preacher didnt come to town to do any fighting. He actually tried to barter a peace between the two...even in warning the miners what would happen when Stockburn arrived. When he left it was to GET his guns, because his hand was forced and he didnt want to see innocent people get hurt.

But the crowning hint, was the final shot to Stockburns head. That was how I knew he was alive. He knew Stockburn could survive those wounds...he did!!! He didnt want Stockburn sneaking up into his future, so he gave him a final shot to the head to make sure it didnt happen.

Stealthy? Yes. But when the Stockburn folk were searching for him in town...nothing he did was supernatural...he hid alot and shot people unaware. BUT, not out of this world stuff.

There is definitely a difference.
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« Reply #45 on: September 19, 2007, 01:48:21 PM »

I'm not so sure that they're the same character.  In "High Plains Drifter", I always thought that Clint's character was getting PERSONAL revenge.  I thought that one lady who served him dinner gave a look at one point in the movie showing that she wasn't sure if she remembered him or not.  But in "Pale Rider", I definately got the impression that Preacher was protecting the town first and foremost, even though he had a history with Stockburn....
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« Reply #46 on: May 31, 2010, 12:29:18 PM »

Little note regarding the Strangers supernatural powers.

In an earlier scene he apparently has eyes in the back of his head as Quade or Chola as we all know him pulls a knife. Yet at the end he isnt aware he is about to be shot and Mordecai saves him. Whats all that about!!!
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« Reply #47 on: June 02, 2010, 08:59:34 AM »

I'm not so sure that they're the same character.  In "High Plains Drifter", I always thought that Clint's character was getting PERSONAL revenge.  I thought that one lady who served him dinner gave a look at one point in the movie showing that she wasn't sure if she remembered him or not.  But in "Pale Rider", I definately got the impression that Preacher was protecting the town first and foremost, even though he had a history with Stockburn....
I need to visit this Forum more often, because I always trip over gems like this thread.   Chessie's teacher is just dead wrong.  Same character?!!  AYKM?!!

I think he gets too caught up in the mystical element of both films, but the theme of the two are about as far apart as you can get.   The Stranger's purpose is vengeance.   The Stranger invented "Shock and Awe" long before the US military.  The Preacher, on the other hand, is very much the reluctant defender (although, I suppose we can't ignore that the Stranger plays coy when asked to defend the god-fearing people in the god-fearing town).   The Stranger takes; the Preacher gives.   The Preacher give us spiritual overtones; the Stranger turns Lago into hell.  The Preacher loves; the Stranger hates.  We also just don't know why Stockburn's eyes show terror when he sees the Preacher; when Stacey sees the Stranger, we know exactly why.

Mystical gunfighters.  Mysterious backgrounds.   The comparisons don't go much farther.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2010, 09:09:21 AM by Sundayjack » Logged

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« Reply #48 on: January 17, 2012, 05:59:03 PM »

This is an older thread, but I'm gonna toss in my "Morgan" so to speak.

In HPD the "stranger" is a revanant, a spirit that has come back from the dead to right a wrong, a terrible wrong. The spirit has, most likely, entered another body (probably one near death) to finally allow it's spirit to rest. (This was used in the movie "The Wraith" starring Charlie Sheen..although in that movie the spirit goes on to live the life that was taken).

In HPD there is a direct mention to a "soul not resting if there is no gravestone" & at the end of the movie we see one being made.

In Pale Rider the "Preacher" is more of a servant of God, answering a child's prayer. My take was that "Preacher" was a bad man (not unlike William Munny) who should have died, but was saved & now does pennance by helping those in need. (It is up to the viewer to decide if this is directed by a Church or by God more directly).
The "Preacher" has been a good servant & so is given the oppurtunity to exact a form of "divine retribution" by being able to have Stockburn & his men become involved.

The reason I don't think "Preacher" is a ghost or spirit is given within the film; ghosts wouldn't need, or keep, a safety deposit box is the most obvious clue.
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The Man With No Aim
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« Reply #49 on: May 25, 2012, 04:22:57 AM »

quoting Josey444 "Any theories on what the heck was going on with the "voice from the past?"".

My conclusion is this...Preacher first did exactly that; preached and persuaded peacefully (pretty much) to try to settle the conflict without deaths. But the unjustified murder of the miner removed the peaceful settlement option. Then the Mysterious Stranger had to drop the peaceful approach and adopt a violent strategy to protect the miners.The Voice signified the change from the possibility of peace for the assailant to the inevitability of violence for the assailant. The Voice calling him a peaceful preacher was from the past because he was no longer able to offer peace but only violence in the future. The Biblical connotation of the Pale Rider is apropo because in the book of Revelation the rider is dispatched to inflict violence upon the earth only after the population of sinners has refused to repent as a result of peaceful preaching. The judgement falling upon the sinners is violence and death by their own choice.

Interviews with CE have settled definitively whether the Mysterious Strangers are ghosts or not. However, I don't know if this thread is meant to be Spoiler Proof so I cannot in good conscience tell you.   

The ending episode of Rider contains a definitive clue about ghost or not. I mean a definitive clue. Watch it again. You might get it. When you notice it, you will know for sure whether Rider is a mere human or a ghost. It is not easy to notice. I have never read of anyone mentioning it before.

So you have to be pushed into watching  a CE film another time? I know  8).
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« Reply #50 on: June 20, 2012, 07:28:02 AM »

Another thought on this...

In watching PULP FICTION, Jules has a near death experience that brings him closer to God.

Perhaps, this is also Preacher's story. That he in fact, SHOULD have died from Stockburn's attack on him. It was him surviving that lead him to God. And oddly enough, God that lead him to Stockburn.
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« Reply #51 on: June 20, 2012, 06:50:29 PM »

Great day in the morning! (Or evening!) A bdc sighting! :D

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« Reply #52 on: July 05, 2012, 10:25:13 AM »

quoting Josey444 "Any theories on what the heck was going on with the "voice from the past?"".

My conclusion is this...Preacher first did exactly that; preached and persuaded peacefully (pretty much) to try to settle the conflict without deaths. But the unjustified murder of the miner removed the peaceful settlement option. Then the Mysterious Stranger had to drop the peaceful approach and adopt a violent strategy to protect the miners.The Voice signified the change from the possibility of peace for the assailant to the inevitability of violence for the assailant. The Voice calling him a peaceful preacher was from the past because he was no longer able to offer peace but only violence in the future. The Biblical connotation of the Pale Rider is apropo because in the book of Revelation the rider is dispatched to inflict violence upon the earth only after the population of sinners has refused to repent as a result of peaceful preaching. The judgement falling upon the sinners is violence and death by their own choice.

Interviews with CE have settled definitively whether the Mysterious Strangers are ghosts or not. However, I don't know if this thread is meant to be Spoiler Proof so I cannot in good conscience tell you.  

The ending episode of Rider contains a definitive clue about ghost or not. I mean a definitive clue. Watch it again. You might get it. When you notice it, you will know for sure whether Rider is a mere human or a ghost. It is not easy to notice. I have never read of anyone mentioning it before.

So you have to be pushed into watching  a CE film another time? I know  8).

If nobody else minds, I would like to know  the clues at the end of Pale Rider.  

I wonder what the altercation was between Stockburn and the preacher in the past?  Was Stockburn and his deputies just hired to kill him, or was it one-on-one in their younger days?  Perhaps they were once partners?  What do you think?  
« Last Edit: July 05, 2012, 11:06:49 AM by KC » Logged
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« Reply #53 on: July 05, 2012, 11:08:18 AM »

I would like to know the clue also, Man With No Aim! Or at least, exactly where we should look for it. :)

herofan, I edited your post so we could see more clearly where the quote from The Man With No Aim stopped and your question began.
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« Reply #54 on: July 06, 2012, 04:57:42 PM »

I found this lengthy interview on You-Tube called "Inside the Actor's Studio with Clint Eastwood."  It may be nothing new to anyone here, but he discussed his career and talked about "High Plains Drifter" and "Pale Rider."  At one point, Clint is asked a question about Pale Rider and he says,    "....I think because I left the ending of High Plains Drifter in such an ambiguous way,  that maybe in Pale Rider I decided that maybe I should just make him an out and out apparition."  The discussion starts at 41:41. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtmZSUbCma8
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« Reply #55 on: July 06, 2012, 05:23:57 PM »

Thanks for the link, herofan! We've discussed the show a few times here, but I don't think anyone ever pointed out the comment about these two characters before.
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The Man With No Aim
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« Reply #56 on: August 05, 2012, 11:35:35 PM »

I would like to know the clue also, Man With No Aim! Or at least, exactly where we should look for it. :)

herofan, I edited your post so we could see more clearly where the quote from The Man With No Aim stopped and your question began.

Others before me have written of valuable clues in Rider which are fully capable of pointing a viewer in the right direction. My clue is one which left me with no doubt about whether Preacher was a mere human bound by the Laws Of Physics or on the other hand was a Ghost, or, more precisely, an avenging Wraith, able to move instantly and undetectably from one location to another.

In the last episode of Rider the Resident Villain has assigned a thug to be the watch man of the main street (I guess also the ONLY street ) of the town. When you watch the film again, be certain to very carefully determine where the watch man is situated and also determine where Preacher is shown to be located taking a coffee.

Next, as the episode plays out, be careful to determine the last location of Preacher. Compare the earlier location with the last location. Ask yourself, if the thug watch man was not blind, could Preacher have moved from his earlier location to his last location successfully.

Becoming a forgetful Old Man, I do not remember exact detail about the CE interview(s) that I read. However the interview quoted immediately previously sure sounds about right.   
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« Reply #57 on: August 11, 2012, 06:48:59 PM »


Others before me have written of valuable clues in Rider which are fully capable of pointing a viewer in the right direction. My clue is one which left me with no doubt about whether Preacher was a mere human bound by the Laws Of Physics or on the other hand was a Ghost, or, more precisely, an avenging Wraith, able to move instantly and undetectably from one location to another.

In the last episode of Rider the Resident Villain has assigned a thug to be the watch man of the main street (I guess also the ONLY street ) of the town. When you watch the film again, be certain to very carefully determine where the watch man is situated and also determine where Preacher is shown to be located taking a coffee.

Next, as the episode plays out, be careful to determine the last location of Preacher. Compare the earlier location with the last location. Ask yourself, if the thug watch man was not blind, could Preacher have moved from his earlier location to his last location successfully.

Becoming a forgetful Old Man, I do not remember exact detail about the CE interview(s) that I read. However the interview quoted immediately previously sure sounds about right.   

Thanks for sharing.  I just rewatched that scene several times to look for that situation.  For me, I don't think that is enough to convince me he was an apparition.  It wasn't any more amazing than what other heroes have done in movies where they were definitely not apparitions.  An argument could be made either way.  Here's what i saw:

The thug with the bandage looks in the window and sees the preacher drinking coffee with his back to the door.  The thugs footsteps are easily heard on the wooden floor.  He steps away and tells the boss thug what he saw.  Several seconds pass as he leaves the window before they go back on the porch and approach the door, which gives preacher plenty of time to change locations.  The windows are very foggy.  As they stand ready to go in, the first looker doesn't look in again.  One of the guys is looking in the window from a few inches back, but he doesn't appear  to focus on anything; his head is looking around as though he is searching.  The boss thug also looks in, but he doesn't say if he sees him.  Perhaps he is only taking the word of the other guy.  If there had been a verbal affirmation that he saw him, I would say there is no way the preacher could have moved that quickly, but he didn't say he saw him. 

I would like to know some other clues.
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« Reply #58 on: August 20, 2012, 07:41:47 AM »

To this last point - while not a very strong clue the bad guys sure shot a lot of bullets into nothing.  One MIGHT infer they saw him...even though he was not there.  This could be an argument that he was an apparition.
Based on this thread, and Clint's own description, I'm still amazed that there is any doubt about HPD.  I think it's emphatically clear he's a ghost - what else explains what he said to Mordecai at the very end ("Yes, you do," at the Marshall's just-engraved headstone)?
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« Reply #59 on: August 20, 2012, 05:49:45 PM »

Based on this thread, and Clint's own description, I'm still amazed that there is any doubt about HPD.  I think it's emphatically clear he's a ghost - what else explains what he said to Mordecai at the very end ("Yes, you do," at Marshall's just-engraved headstone)?


It could mean, "You know my name ... It's Duncan, same as my brother's."
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