News: See SULLY, starring Tom Hanks, now streaming and on DVD and Blu-ray!


0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this board.
« previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 Go Down Print
Author Topic: Steve's "The GOOD the BAD and the UGLY" or "UNFORGIVEN" thread  (Read 19733 times)
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #20 on: December 27, 2005, 10:47:05 AM »

Originally posted by Steve, 03-11-99 05:40 PM 


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  (Image no longer available) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

I like your down to earth honest opinion Conan. And Holden...the reason I was getting so defensive about GBU was due to GMAT's saying that just because it may have been "more entertaining" to me. GBU was much more than entertainment...but I won't get into that again. They were two totally different films. I did think that GBU was quite a bit more on the "upbeat" side.

I am disappointed that there haven't been any newcomers or lurkers jumping in.

In a recent magazine write up which I am still trying to find, GBU was rated the #2 "guy" movie of all time. But I have found some women to really like it also.

Anyway, I'll be back as soon as I burn this UNFORGIVEN VHS tape that is starting to irritate me!

------------------
"A couple steps back"
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #21 on: December 27, 2005, 10:48:14 AM »

Originally posted by Cal Anderson, 03-11-99 07:01 PM


Just got Unforgiven on DVD.

WOW!
« Last Edit: December 27, 2005, 11:01:36 AM by Matt » Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #22 on: December 27, 2005, 10:48:51 AM »

Originally posted by Steve, 03-11-99 07:06 PM


Which means you got GBU on DVD first! Good choice Cal!
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #23 on: December 27, 2005, 10:49:33 AM »

Originally posted by Manco, 03-11-99 07:27 PM   

GBU is THE best western ever!!! I love it bso much. UNFORGIVEN is really good too but I don't think it even comes close to the nlevel of greatest that GBU achieves. GBU is PURE CINEMA!
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #24 on: December 27, 2005, 10:50:08 AM »

Originally posted by ibn, 03-11-99 07:36 PM


[This message has been edited by ibn (edited 03-11-99).]
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #25 on: December 27, 2005, 10:50:53 AM »

Originally posted by Steve, 03-11-99 07:50 PM 

Now, everyone...listen to what Manco has to say. That's a guy who knows what he is talking about!(now don't I remember you from somewhere before?)

ibn, your comment was..well, no words can describe it!

------------------
"A couple steps back"
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #26 on: December 27, 2005, 10:51:30 AM »

Originally posted by KC, 03-11-99 10:13 PM


What was that you were trying to say, Manco? You love its b.s. so much?
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #27 on: December 27, 2005, 10:52:09 AM »

Originally posted by Holden Pike, 03-11-99 10:33 PM

Good to hear from you again, Manco. You were one of the regulars from the old board who didn't make the initial transition over here. What do you think of the new crib Cal found us?
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #28 on: December 27, 2005, 10:52:59 AM »

Originally posted by Steve, 03-12-99 03:39 AM


I will translate MANCO's message above reading from between the lines:

DAMN! That GBU is so FREAKING good that I can NO LONGER remain dormant and must post concerning this issue!

The Good The Bad And The Ugly: there IS no substitute...

------------------
"A couple steps back"
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #29 on: December 27, 2005, 10:56:03 AM »

Originally posted by CR, 03-12-99 08:40 AM

Stop this train, I wanna get on:

1. Unforgiven, by a long shot.

2. The thing is, I wouldn't even have to think about it--I prefer For a Few Dollars More to GBU. I even like Indio better than Tuco. And I think the final shootout in FaFDM with the musical watches is VASTLY superior to the three-man in GBU. (Might as well bring up this stuff, since everything else has been covered, and just present the points made in the epic Unforgiven posts of a couple of months ago as exhibit A.)

3. While I find that most times, when I'm not dedicating myself to sitting down and watching a movie, distraction free, or watching it with someone else, I watch key scenes in GBU and skip a lot. Unforgiven, on the other hand, is like Vertigo--if I see 5 seconds of it, at absolutely any point in the film, I'm hooked and can't help stopping whatever I'm doing, turning off the lights and watching it through to the end.

4. The laconic, poetic dialogue, beauty and subtlty of Unforgiven intermingled with brutal (and cheerless, and upsetting, and long and unglorified: see the deaths of Davy Boy, Ned, etc., the relentless depiction of the attack on Delilah, and so on--no sugar to help that medicine go down) violence and Hemingwayish bleak vision of stupid, hopeless humanity are all absolutely beyond compare. As much as I like GBU--and I do, very much--I just can't even put it in the same league as Unforgiven. Unforgiven is just so good that I can't even express it. It's just magnificent, in every way, and the greatest Western ever made, bar none.

5. GMAT, I disagree completely--I don't think Michael Jordan was more exciting early in his career at all. As quick and athletic as he was, it just doesn't compare to the beauty and artistry of his later game. As Phil Jackson once said, "...it aproaches ballet". Nothing he did early in his career compares with the unparalled Game Five in Utah in the '97 Finals, or even the Double Nickel in NY or, of course, The Great Eraser of Mistakes' final, unforgettable moments in Game Six last year, when he carried the world on his back one last, beautiful, majestic, indelable, incredible time.

I know that wasn't your point--or even a point--at all, but I couldn't resist. I'm about 200 times as passionate about Jordan than I am about Unforgiven.

6. And finally--finally--I am interested, GMAT, why you rank Pale Rider so high.
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #30 on: December 27, 2005, 11:00:02 AM »

Originally posted by Manco, 03-12-99 10:36 AM

Hey, thanks Holden and Steve for the support. But as for KC, you can bite me!(yes, I'm just joking around). Sorry about the typos, I was just so eager to express my love for GBU that I hurried through it. But thanks Steve for the rewrite, that's pretty much what I wanted to say. And Holden, you're right, I used to post on the Leone discussion board before Micheal kicked me off for cussing on his Martin Scorsese board. But now I really like all these boards that Cal has created. Thanks Steve for the link to this place in your post at the Leone board! To continue my thoughts on GBU, it has such a cinematic effect with the great cinematography and music that I really feel it's light years ahead of UNFORGIVEN, even if it's not as "serious" or "important. I like UNFORGIVEN but it comes no where near as close to my heart as GBU.
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #31 on: December 27, 2005, 11:01:01 AM »

Originally posted by Cal Anderson, 03-12-99 10:36 AM


This thread has a life on its own.

Steve - yeah your are right - my first two DVD purchases were High Plains Drifter and GBU (I couldnt resist the 14 minutes of unseen Italian footage!)

Unforgiven was my third choice but only by default because of the money involved. Otherwise I would have bought all three at the same time.

A few notes on my take on this whole conversation. Both fims are great!!! They are completely different yet equal in my opinion. GBU is great popcorn comic book cinema. Unforgiven is has superior poetic depths that GBU doesnt have.

SOme of Clint's best performances in his career can be seen in Unforgiven however, I dont think the same can be said for GBU.
One of my favorite scenes (there are many) in Unforgiven is when after Clint is sick and he is sitting there talking to Delilah. Another great scene is when Clint shoots the first victim and the moments that follow as you hear the victim cry out that he's dying. Lots of shades of grey in this film, something you dont really experience in GBU.

------------------
Cal Anderson
Web Site Administrator
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #32 on: December 27, 2005, 11:02:42 AM »

Originally posted by CR, 03-12-99 11:11 AM

I find it humourous that someone would be kicked of a Scorcese board for cussing.

Cal, I love the scene with Delilah, too. It's exactly what I was thinking of while writing about the dialogue in Unforgiven. It's just so simple and beautiful. That's a great scene.

The Davy Boy scene is brilliant and completely unique, too. The whole, drawn out "would you get him a drink of water, for chrissake?" thing is like nothing you'll see in any other western, or even any action movie of any sort that I can think of (not like I consider Unforgiven an action movie, but you know what I mean).
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #33 on: December 27, 2005, 11:03:27 AM »

Originally posted by Conan, 03-12-99 01:07 PM

I agree CR, Scorcese movies are hardcore, so I could see how the dicussion we at least be semi-hardcore. Personally, I find nothing wrong with cussing, unless of course used in an insulting manner. Quick curse test for the old times sake - (****, ****, damn, hell, numbnuts, ****nuts, ********, **, ***, ******************, **************, ****-for-brains, *******).

By the way, I have heard bad things about a company called Macady(or Macaday) that makes DVD titles. Poor quality, so be warned.

Hehe, had to edit a word off the cuss-test that got by that mind offend some.
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #34 on: December 27, 2005, 11:04:03 AM »

Originally posted by ibn, 03-12-99 01:20 PM


How the fucl< did we get on to cussing?
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #35 on: December 27, 2005, 11:06:47 AM »

Originally posted by Steve, 03-12-99 01:41 PM

"Holy sh!t! Where did all of this phucking water come from"?!
-Captain of the Titanic

My 2 cents on cussing for the day.

Well, there you have it. Cal had a choice. Out of 3 DVD's, Unforgiven was his last choice! On Clint's GBU performance...well, his role was the man-with-no-name who also was a man-with-little-to-say so his role was pretty limited by design. To me, Wallach was and is the star. But it IS a Clint western because HE was in it.

Seriously...they ARE 2 totally different flicks. Where GBU is full of violent confrontation, action and excitement....as well as a little humor, UNFORGIVEN is (to me) deep, dark, serious, and above all, has an ending that doesn't quite have you skipping up the aisle on your way out.

I REALLY do like UNFORGIVEN alot, but like I said before, this is a question of what movie do you like the best...and if I had to have only ONE western to see for the rest of my life...THE GOOD THE BAD AND THE UGLY would be the one for me! If I had to watch only UNFORGIVEN over and over the rest of my life...I'd be swinging from a noose myself from self-induced mental depression....

"even when Judas hung himself there was a storm".

------------------
"A couple steps back"
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #36 on: December 27, 2005, 11:17:23 AM »

Originally posted by KC, 03-12-99 02:08 PM

That just might be cannon fire ...
Thanks, Cal and CR, for taking the words out of my mouth. I wouldn't trade either of those two scenes for almost anybody else's whole movie, ever. And there are so many more on that level in Unforgiven—how about the "deathbed scene" where we go from a sickened sense of relief that at least he thinks he's seen Claudia to the horror at hearing "her face was all covered with worms" to the heart-wrenching plea that his legend (this film that we are watching, in other words) might die with him: "Don't tell nobody ... don't tell my kids ... none of the things I done ..." (If you listen very closely, after he's managed to get those words out, you can barely hear him gasping "God ... God"—whether in agony or supplication, who could say?) And to start it all off he's told Ned "I seen him ... the Angel of Death ... He's got snake eyes." That is, he much resembles the Man With No Name.

And Steve, if you haven't discovered the humor in Unforgiven yet ... sorry pardner, but you've got a few more viewings to go. I think it's one of the most remarkable films ever made for the way it integrates its humor with its tragedy. In other words, there is no comic relief: the comedy comes when you are in the middle of being put through the ringer by the tragedy. Like the killing of Davey Boy: While Ned and Will are agonizing over which man will have to take rifle in hand and kill the boy, and neither wants to, and Ned physically can't and Will "ain't very good with one of these [rifles]," the Schofield Kid, the one who led them out on this ghastly "last ride" in the first place, keeps calling out plaintively to know what is going on, because he is physically as well as morally purblind, and it's funny and horrid at the same time and you want to look away but you just can't.

KC
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #37 on: December 27, 2005, 11:19:09 AM »

Originally posted by CR, 03-12-99 02:12 PM


A. I think Unforgiven has it's share of humour too, though. Don't you? Every tragedy needs comic relief--I don't know if Unforgiven is a tragedy, but it is quite brooding and serious at times and makes (I think) great use of lighter moments throughout the film.

B. If I had to watch Unforgiven over and over for the rest of my life, I'd be beside myself with joy! I wish that were my job. Somebody make me an offer.
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #38 on: December 27, 2005, 11:20:16 AM »

Originally posted by Steve, 03-12-99 02:21 PM

Oh yes, I can see the humor in Unforgiven. It just isn't the same kind of humor. Like for instance the humor in the Sherriff's office when they were all loading their guns waiting for Little Bill or at the Bar-T when they were hiding out and Quick Mike was making jokes. Besides, I was commenting on GBU's humor...which is MUCH more light hearted. I made no mention of Unforgiven's darker humor.

No matter what ya'll say...I'll never concede that U is a better film than GBU. They are both good but different. I think there are alot of people who are loyal to the film maker/actor rather than to the film itself. I don't like ANY film just because of who was in it or who made it...I like them for what they are.

DAMN! 5:20 pm! I gotta get home. Shoulda been outta here 20 minutes ago. If I hurry up, I can squeeze in some GBU just before my date gets over and have to go see some damn chic flick!

------------------
"A couple steps back"
Logged
Matt
Global Moderator
Member Extraordinaire
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13879



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #39 on: December 27, 2005, 11:23:10 AM »

Originally posted by KC, 03-12-99 02:42 PM


Chick flick?
"You're hanging out with the wrong kind of people, Block" (Tightrope—quoted from memory.)

Personally, I don't like Unforgiven because it's Eastwood's, but quite the other way round ... I came to appreciate Eastwood because of Unforgiven. It was the very first Eastwood film I ever saw and it simply swept away any preconceived notions I had about either 1) Clint Eastwood or 2) what constitutes a truly great cinematic work of art.

CR, let me know if you get that job, I'll move North and be your assistant.

KC
Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 Go Up Print 
 




C L I N T E A S T W O O D . N E T