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Poll

Who is the greatest rock band?

AC/DC
0 (0%)
Led Zeppelin
3 (23.1%)
Guns N' Roses
2 (15.4%)
The Rolling Stones
5 (38.5%)
KISS
0 (0%)
Eagles
0 (0%)
Pink Floyd
2 (15.4%)
Queen
1 (7.7%)

Total Members Voted: 11

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Author Topic: Rock Band  (Read 15464 times)
GBU
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« on: October 11, 2004, 11:43:13 AM »

Zeppelin. No questions asked.

I know that there quite a few people on this forum that like classic rock, so I want to know what ya'll like.

If you think another band should be on here, please, discuss why.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2004, 11:47:55 AM by Good, Bad, and Ugly » Logged

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Matt
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« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2004, 04:43:08 PM »

I think you forgot one.

(You don't really need me to tell you who, do you?  :-\ )
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Brendan
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« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2004, 05:15:00 PM »

I think you forgot one.

(You don't really need me to tell you who, do you?  :-\ )

Let's just assume he means between the ones available.  ;) I agree that tha band your thinking of Matt, is the best.  8)
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Matt
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« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2004, 05:37:26 PM »

Ugh, I can't believe there's a "Best Rock Band" poll, and KISS, AC/DC and Guns 'n Roses are on it, but not The Beatles.

If GBU thought of The Rolling Stones, how can you not have The Beatles on the list?

That's like having a "Best Western Actor" poll and having John Wayne, but not Clint Eastwood.

Anyway, I'd have to vote for the Stones out of this batch, but I won't vote because the poll is just not worthy of voting in if the undisputed greatest rock band of all time isn't listed.

I'd also have The Kinks on there, but that omission is more understandable.
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GBU
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« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2004, 06:30:38 PM »

I really don't consider the Beatles a rock band, buts that it just me. If you compare the music to Led, or AC/DC, they just don't sound the same. They are more of a soft rock, not a "rock" rock. I just put the Rolling Stones on there for filler, I couldn't think of another band to put on it. This poll was created on my opinion, sorry for not looking at other choices.

If you want to, delete this poll, and create one suitable of voting on, because I want to know what ya'll like.

I am sorry to say, Matt, that I have never heard of The Kinks.
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« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2004, 07:33:24 PM »

I really don't consider the Beatles a rock band...

Uh-oh...
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Matt
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« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2004, 07:40:49 PM »

You're mixing Heavy Metal and Classic Rock.  The Beatles are absolutely a rock band. They are NOT a metal band. AC/DC,  Led Zeppelin, Guns 'n Roses and KISS are all metal bands. Of COURSE The Beatles don't sound like them! The Beatles are a rock band.

Ugh.

Do you like Motley Crue too? Last time someone thought the Beatles weren't a rock band, he thought Motley Crue was the best rock band of all time. I could be sick.

I realize you're only 17, you get a pass. But, if you don't think the Beatles are a rock band, then I heartily suggest you start listening to them before you write them off. Listen to the Kinks too. Classic rock... the best.
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Matt
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« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2004, 08:02:22 PM »

By the way... what is this, a ballad?

http://www.geocities.com/mattreigns/HelterSkelter.html

(Click link inside...  and anyone who wants to still tell me the Beatles aren't a rock band can go right ahead and try it.)

(The link may go down now and then, if it doesn't work, try back later.)
« Last Edit: October 11, 2004, 08:02:55 PM by Matt » Logged
GBU
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« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2004, 08:46:15 PM »

You're mixing Heavy Metal and Classic Rock.  The Beatles are absolutely a rock band. They are NOT a metal band. AC/DC,  Led Zeppelin, Guns 'n Roses and KISS are all metal bands. Of COURSE The Beatles don't sound like them!

First of all AC/DC, Zep, and KISS are NOT heavy metal. Metallica is heavy metal. That is a totally different catagory of music.

Apparently we have different defintions of rock. The Beatles are rock n' roll, like Elvis. Zep, and them are classic rock.

Songs that I consider oldies probably were the popular music back in your day. The Beatles were considered one of the first rock bands. Of course you will still consider them rock. But then rock n' roll evolved into what I consider classic rock, (AC/DC, Zep), so my opinion of rock is going to be differnt than yours.

I do listen to the Beatles. My father has ALL of their records, so I have heard every one of their songs. So don't think that I don't listen to them, just because I see them in a different light than you.


Motley Crue. You think that because I have a different view of rock, that I listen to music that is an abombnation to life? Honestly, that band does not even deserve to be spoken by any human being on this planet.
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Matt
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« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2004, 08:49:39 PM »

First of all AC/DC, Zep, and KISS are NOT heavy metal. Metallica is heavy metal. That is a totally different catagory of music.

Metallica is heavy metal. You're the first person I've ever heard say that Led Zeppelin isn't a heavy metal band. They're the definitive heavy metal band. And yes, AC/DC and KISS are metal bands too.

The Beatles are NOT rock 'n roll like Elvis. They are rock. Classic rock. Just rock. Comparable to The Stones and The Kinks. Not comparable to AC/DC and the others mentioned.

And I think that anyone who never heard of the Kinks, and is trying to tell me about rock music is a joke. No offense.
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GBU
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« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2004, 09:09:03 PM »

So you are telling me that Zep and Metallica are in the same category? That is false. Metallica is all metal. Zep is rock and blues. Not even close to metal.  I agree that AC/DC and Guns are a little metal. They have more qualities of classic rock than metal though.

Listen all I am saying is that The Beatles don't fit into the poll I created. I created a poll of "different rock" compared to the Beatles. Maybe two out of the eight are metal, the rest are classic rock. Thats all I'm saying.
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Matt
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« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2004, 09:10:37 PM »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_metal_music

Read, and learn.

Anyway... if you had the Stones, then I'd expect the Beatles. They're in the same category.
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GBU
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« Reply #12 on: October 12, 2004, 07:06:12 AM »

If we go by that definition of rock, than the Beatles are Heavy Metal as well. I quote, from your link,

Quote
Some also cite The Beatles as a key influence; they had increasingly used distortion and heavier arrangements as early as 1967's Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band.

Though it says influence, that means that they were like Heavy Metal. We cannot go by that definition.

Ask anyone if Black Sabbath is Metal or Acid. 80%, (yes I took a poll at my school, I asked 25 kids who are fimilar with Sabbath) says Sabbath is more Acid than Metal.

Quote
Anyway... if you had the Stones, then I'd expect the Beatles. They're in the same category.

Read what I said before. I put the Stones in there for filler, I couldn't think of another band to put in it.

I agree with you that the Stones and the Beatles are in the same category.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2004, 07:12:14 AM by Good, Bad, and Ugly » Logged

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GBU
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« Reply #13 on: October 12, 2004, 07:38:24 AM »

What I am about to do is compare the bands on my list to the definiton in that link.

Quote
Heavy metal is a form of rock music characterized by aggressive, driving rhythms and highly amplified and distorted guitars,

True

Quote
and the themes explored in heavy metal lyrics are often dark or sexually explicit.

False

Quote
Heavy metal is a development of blues music and blues rock and pop. Its first wave, between 1967 and 1974, was a hybrid of pop and blues.

True

Quote
bands such as the Rolling Stones and The Yardbirds had recorded covers of many classic blues songs, sometimes speeding up the tempo and using electric guitar where the original used acoustic. (Similar adaptations of blues and other race music had formed the basis of the earliest rock and roll, notably that of Elvis Presley).

Earlier you said that Elvis and the Beatles are in different catagories. Here they say that Elvis and the Stones were very similar. You said that the Stones and the Beatles were in the same category. Therefore Elvis and the Beatles are in the same category.

Quote
Beatles scholars cite in particular the song "Helter Skelter" from The White Album (1968), which set new standards for distortion and aggressive sound on a pop album.

Again saying that the Beatles influenced heavy metal. Therefore are considered to be partley heavy metal.

Quote
heavy metal being a metaphor for addictive drugs

I guess this means every band, every musician from the mid 60's to the late 70's is heavy metal.

Quote
The fact that Led Zeppelin (whose moniker came partly in reference to Keith Moon's jest that they would "go over like a lead balloon") incorporated a heavy metal into its name may have sealed the usage of the term.

You got me here buddy. Touche.

All I am trying to say is that the Beatles wouldn't not have fit into the list I created. It would be like putting Seline Dion in with Bon Jovi. They technically are both rock, just in different categories. Seline is soft rock, while Bon Jovi is hard rock.
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GBU
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« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2004, 02:49:08 PM »

I am getting tired of this petty argument over something as dumb as classifying bands. We should get back to being Clint fans instead of bickering rockers. :P
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Matt
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« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2004, 03:18:20 PM »

I don't blame you for getting tired of it... you're arguing with someone that you really should be agreeing with. I would say to come back after reading a few books of the history of rock music, and after another decade or so of listening to the music, but by then you wouldn't be debating with me, you'd realize that I'm right on all accounts.  :P

Let me just briefly pick away at more of your arguments before I, too, let this argument go the wayside:

1)  You said since the Beatles influenced heavy metal, that they are a heavy metal band. I think you're simply being argumentative here, since you actually don't even believe the Beatles are a rock band, let alone a heavy metal band. But, to prove the point of how ridiculous your argument here is... consider that Van Halen was influenced by Bach and Mozart... does that, then, make Bach and Mozart rock artists? Think about it.  Some would say that Muhammad Ali influenced rap music... he was certainly not a rap artist though.

2)  " the themes explored in heavy metal lyrics are often dark or sexually explicit."  Do you not understand the word "often", or do you just choose to ignore it? It's not a false statement.

3)  Elvis is a rock 'n roll artist. When the Beatles started out, for the first 18 months or so of their recording career, I could agree that they were a rock 'n roll band. However, with the release of Rubber Soul as early as 1965 the Beatles music matured beyond that of a "rock 'n' roll" band... most people consider this music simply to be called "rock" music. At this point, the Beatles had absolutely nothing in common with Elvis Presley. They had as much in common with Elvis as Celine Dion has with the Beatles (I'm gonna have a good time tearing that point of yours apart soon).   This link attemps to show a pretty good history of "rock 'n roll" and if you scroll down, you'll see a section on the British Invasion (which started the same year the Beatles hit America, in 1964. Elvis is in an era earlier than that, from the "Early North American Rock 'n Roll" era. Saying that Elvis and The Rolling Stones had similar influences does not necessarily put them in the same category... see my above example of Bach and Beethoven with Van Halen). As in the last link I sent you, this is not a "definition" of a term, it's a brief history of music... and very, very accurate. I don't know how you can dispute this unless you have no clue about the history or rock and heavy metal music (and I have a feeling that's more accurate than you want to believe... not knowing Led Zeppelin was a heavy metal band, not considering the Beatles a rock band, and thinking that Beatles are "Elvis-like", never having even heard of The Kinks, one of the foremost pioneers of rock music, and I could go on and on) Anyway, here's the link... read it:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_and_roll  

4) Yes, the Beatles influenced Heavy Metal. The Beatles influenced every band that came out after them, either directly or indirectly.

5) Celine Dion is NOT a rock artist. Putting her against Bon Jovi in a poll is NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT like putting the Beatles, the GREATEST ROCK BAND of all time in the same poll as the Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin, etc.

6) Acid rock is a derivative of heavy metal. There are many such subcategories. Heavy metal is a subcategory of rock... but a rock artist does not equal a heavy metal artist.  A heavy metal artist IS a rock artist.  When you said the Beatles didn't sound like Led Zeppelin, AC/DC, Guns 'n Roses, KISS, etc, I agreed... but it's not because the Beatles weren't a rock band, it's because the other bands you listed are heavy metal bands.)

It's absolutely ridiculous to not consider the Beatles a rock band. Revolver has been rated year after year after year as the greatest ROCK album of ALL TIME.  Here's one quick link... you can find hundreds more if you want to look:  http://www3.estart.com/arab/entertainment/beatlesrevolver.html

But, you don't consider them a rock band.

Do you realize that with every post you make you prove that you know less and less about rock music? You're burying yourself here, kid. Seriously...  read a few books about rock music, and listen to a lot more of it. Get back to me in a few years.

« Last Edit: October 12, 2004, 03:33:24 PM by Matt » Logged
Hemlock
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« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2004, 03:39:18 PM »

From that list I don`t have any troubles finding my favorite.
The Rolling Stones is the world`s greatest Rock`N`Roll band.
However there are very close seconds as always.Like Led Zeppelin,AC/DC,Aerosmith and so on.
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« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2004, 03:45:10 PM »

From that list I don`t have any troubles finding my favorite.
The Rolling Stones is the world`s greatest Rock`N`Roll band.

They're definitely in the Top 3.  I'd put them 2nd behind only the Beatles (no big surprise, eh ;) ).  Led Zeppelin would maybe come in 3rd for me. Aerosmith, The Kinks and U2 are way up there too.
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GBU
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« Reply #18 on: October 12, 2004, 03:56:11 PM »

Matt......why couldn't just vote and let it slide instead of these wasted posts. Honestly, this was my opinionated poll, there was no reason to stomp it just because your opinion is different :(. I thought that these were suitable choices for a poll. I didn't think of the Beatles because I didn't want to. Why? My opinion! You have yours. I didn't try to stomp it by saying somthing like, "Beatles? What is your deal man?!". Then we got into this argument that wasn't even about the topic.

Just like in politics, you could be Democratic, I could be Republican, doesen't me we can respect each others opinions, am I right?

I would just like to point out that the title of the poll was "Which is the greatest band?". I don't recall saying "ever" or "in the world". So I was saying who do you like the most in these choices. So next time, think of a poll as an opinion, not a scientifically studied subject.

One more thing before I lock this, when I said my opinion about the Beatles, this was a view from my era. You got to remember, 7 times out of 10 people are not going to even care about this old rock. So of course I am not going to have a wider knowledge of rock, than somebody who lived through it. Thats the facts, Jack.



1) Led Zeppelin
2) Eagles
3) AC/DC
4) Guns N' Roses
5) Aerosmith
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« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2004, 04:00:42 PM »

Hey, I said you left a band out...  you were the one who said you didn't consider the Beatles a rock band. And you were the one who said the other bands weren't heavy metal bands, and got defensive and argumentative when I corrected you. Sorry, but THEM'S the facts, Jack... not much opinion in any of my posts--just facts backed up with a non-opinionated source. The only opinion I may have given was that the Beatles were the "greatest" rock band of all time, and that "opinion" may even be a fact if you're looking at sales figures and record charts, etc.  Why didn't I "just vote and let it slide"? Last I checked, this was a discussion board, not a polling company.  Besides, you did say in your opening post "If you think another band should be on here, please, discuss why."

I hope you learned something from this discussion. If so, then it was worth it. :)
« Last Edit: October 12, 2004, 04:53:35 PM by Matt » Logged
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